Reading What Sucks

Apr 28, 2002 22:39 # 2855

madmaxx *** posts about...

Amok in erfurt and gothic

96% | 2

whilel zapping i just saw that in the late news of f...... RTL 2 the tried to find a connection between the mass murder of erfurt killing several people (afair including himself) and gothic because those a******* found a song in connection with murder lyrics. same i saw on some onlime magazines blaming fps on the same topic.

i really have to stand up here. nor i'm very keen on fps nore i'm very involved in the gothic scene. tough i know quite some nice guys from both.

it simply is WRONG!!! i personally prefere role games and adventures and good old heavy metal and progressive metal (yeah, dream theater and royal hunter rule!) but anyway i somtimes play fps' i like listening to gothic and attending some cocerts everyonce in a while and ALL I HAVE TO SAY IS THAT THOSE BLOODY SENSATION REPORTERS LIE! i'd rather try to say the're wrong but actually they lie!

they don't know nothing 'bout gothic or fps games but they judge on what those a******* think they know wihtout the need of proper research within both the communtities and scientific studdies.

actually just my 2 cents but i'm shure i'm not allone...

If you tell the truth you don't have to remember anything. -- Mark Twain

Apr 29, 2002 08:29 # 2862

Martin *** replies...

Re: Amok in erfurt and gothic

93% | 2

We all have to be aware of the fact that we're right in the middle of a major election campaign here in Germany right now. So all our public puppets act even more psyched and deeply distressed than they even normally would. Also any calls for consequenses will be even louder and more drastic as everybody sees the chance of showing his own profile right now. Its such a filthy situation: on the backs of the dead and their relatives we will hear discussions about who can prevent such events more effectivley and which bans seem more effective. And on top of that our yellow press searching for the latest hidden secrets where never have been any, and if they dont find anything they think of something.
I heard a few reports meanwhile like the one madmaxx refers to. Its so amazing what this fuckin so call coverage is making of situations like this. The first thing I heard was a report about the guy when it was not clear who he was. They said that obviously there was no connection to the Right Scene, and if you only could hear the disappointment in the voice of the reporter! Then they showed 30 seconds pictures of fascist marching in line, waving Nazis flags and stuff! It was CLEAR already there is no connection!
Later, think yesterday, I heard a sentence that kept in mind like a tattoo: "Steini gehoerte einer verrueckten Szene an: er hoerte Heavy Metal, rauchte Hasch und spielte Computerspiele mit gewaltverherrlichendem Inhalt".
Dont know if I can translate all details of stupidity with this sentence: "Steini (the knickname of the guy) belonged to a mad scene: he listened to Heavy Metal, smoking pot and played computer games with violence glorifying contents."
I mean...what shall I say...can there be any more forbidden oversimplification??
No more comments on that one!

I think we all just have to listen very closely to the likes of reports we're getting right now, collect (if you're interested) details and make up your own mind, dont swallow any pre-chewed opinions!

After decades of construction my website is finally up an running: www.kkds.de

Apr 29, 2002 14:14 # 2866

gentledeepwaters *** replies...

Re: Amok in erfurt and gothic

?% | 1

These kids have one thing in common......lousy role models...ie political leaders, movie stars, and yes musicians.....priests, etc....

How many kids have someone they can trust to discuss anything with.......a person older than themselves....pre adolescent and teen years are hell on earth.....unless you have a high esteem and a solid loving family behind you.....

quis custodiet ipsos custodes?

Apr 30, 2002 09:54 # 2877

Jaz *** replies...

Re: Amok in erfurt and gothic

Later, think yesterday, I heard a sentence that kept in mind like a tattoo: "Steini gehoerte einer verrueckten Szene an: er hoerte Heavy Metal, rauchte Hasch und spielte Computerspiele mit gewaltverherrlichendem Inhalt".

"Auf seinem Computer wurde ein Trainingsprogramm zum Erschießen von Menschen gefunden."

Sorry I tried but I just couldn't manage to translate this sentence.

'Yeah, That's what Jesus would do. Jesus would bomb Afghanistan. Yeah.' - snowlion

Apr 29, 2002 17:52 # 2873

Orchid *** throws in her two cents...

Is it all a matter of education?

94% | 2

Why is the question everybody asks: Parents, pupils, journalists, everyone.
And we all find ourselves dicussing that question for hours with a lot of people because the human soul is so unknown to us.
And some people just give the wrong answers.
It's not just Erfurt, violent video games and movies, Marilyn Manson, they all have to take the rap for human catastrophies like this.
But we all know it's going deeper.
It is too intricate to understand.
After I read or heard of runners amok I usually think of it and think of me being able to do it so, too. And I think I could do it. I have once been into a very frightening situation where I remarked I lost control over my actions. It was terrible and I don't want to live through this again. It was an unusual and extreme psychic situation.
From then on I think this can happen to everyone. Think of the biggest drama that could happen to you, add maybe drugs, maybe something else, infinite desperation and the will to die, no one's around and a pain in your soul that hurts too much. What you'll do know is just depending on your character. If your choleric you depend running amok.
Add puberty, the most difficult phase of anthropogenesis, and your abiltiy of handling with a weapon. It's maybe just the situation when a mother slips her hand. OK, this isn't a planned action compared to a shooting.
Well, I don't know either.

"Sie wollen nichts anderes. Sie wollen kämpfen! Sie sind Soldaten! Fucking Wahnsinnige!" - Noel G.

Apr 30, 2002 08:58 # 2876

Jaz *** rants...

Re: Is it all a matter of education?

95% | 2

Is the question of "Why?" so hard to answer? Unforgivable negligence allowed this seriously ill person to get his hands on highly dangerous weapons. That's it. No nazis, no video games. Just negligence and illness.

I think I've never heared so many false lies from our politicians as I did in the past days. Not even after the WTC attacks. As Martin already said, it's election year.

Just a handful of cents:

- Don't tell me this guy wasn't sick to the bone if he goes on and on after the first murders.

- I've been playing "violence glorifying" games since I was ten. The first time I had an (unloaded) gun in my hands I just wanted to get away from it as far as possible. It feels like a freaking nuke ticking in your hands. Don't tell me there's no difference between real and virtual violence.

- Go ahead and raise the age bar to 21. Go forbid movies, games, and take away our other freedoms in the false name of protecting our children. It has nothing to do with the cause of this terrible event. It will happen again, despite all your new laws, and eventually, after many more taken off freedoms, you will realize that you're not even curing the symptoms of the desease.

See you later, I'm off to play some Counter-Strike.

'Yeah, That's what Jesus would do. Jesus would bomb Afghanistan. Yeah.' - snowlion

This post was edited by Jaz on Apr 30, 2002.

Apr 30, 2002 11:22 # 2880

Orchid *** replies...

Re: Is it all a matter of education?

94% | 2

I agree with you. I think most of us can draw a line between virtuality and reality. And a lot of people can play Rambo there but don't dare to touch a weapon. Shooting is a little fascination but it's again a difference if you shoot on a wall or if you aim your gun to a man. A lot of hate is necessary for this action.
And of course it's the soul that makes people go crazy, not a game or a song. "Healthy" people can watch Friday the thirteenth without running amok rigth after. "Ill" people maybe just see it as a way to do. They do what they plan anyway, if there were such movies and stuff or not. Or haven't there been such people before the invention of the TV!?
The human race has its rotten points and we have to live with it. The only thing we can do is educate our children diligently and with love. Sometimes it's very hard to find a right way because there can't be a right way. We all make mistakes.
I often ask myself where the misery started? I mean there's a man who abuses children. You get to know now that he has been abused in his youth, too. And therefore had no imagination of it being wrong, the whole world gets different when you've been hurt so much. Some people hide it till death deep in their soul, others let it break out. Neither is good. And what is our task? The society always shows those people how wrong thy are, avoid meeting their eyes and talk of them behind backs. This makes it even worse because it doesn't give the "wrong" person any chance of healing.

"Sie wollen nichts anderes. Sie wollen kämpfen! Sie sind Soldaten! Fucking Wahnsinnige!" - Noel G.

Apr 30, 2002 13:26 # 2882

Martin *** replies...

Re: Is it all a matter of education?

100% | 3

Maybe there's another point to take into consideration.

As sad and tragic this incident is for everyone being involved, basicly its just that: an incident. I mean we had three cases of this kind within the last five years (in Germany). Three of 82 Million people turned mad this way. I dont feel its such a threatening number whatever the reasons are.

I'd be interested in the number of people killed by car "accidents" where alcohol was involved within the same period of time (which I call murder as well).

Or the number of people being smashed up by NeoNazis.

Or the number of foreign people/refugees deported back to their countries of birth and abused or even killed there.

Its not an act of nonexisting mercy when I say this incident is getting way too much attention nation- even world-wide (looking at CNN or BBC). It is media effective, got good pictures, and of course lots of people got a lot to comment on it (which is as important as farting in the wind). For my taste its worth a report, yes, but thats basicaly it. And even the fact that we are talking about/looking for possible reasons or explanations *here* somehow makes me wonder why.

After decades of construction my website is finally up an running: www.kkds.de

Apr 30, 2002 20:33 # 2886

Orchid *** replies...

Re: Is it all a matter of education?

This incident caused so much attention because the killer was just a boy, and he planned the murder. And these things don't happen that often. But I read always evers day in the news paper that a drunken drove over a child or an old man. Every of these are terrible and we are hurt by the sort we meet but a drunken didn't planned to kill. It's tragic, however and e.g. more and more teenagers driving to here and there too fast and smashing up their parents Mercedes maybe too killing others are filling the papers. It occupies our thinking for some days and goes away again, Erfurt will do so. too but we have to see it was bigger, more victims, similar to 11.9.

"Sie wollen nichts anderes. Sie wollen kämpfen! Sie sind Soldaten! Fucking Wahnsinnige!" - Noel G.

May 01, 2002 11:11 # 2887

Jaz *** replies...

Re: Is it all a matter of education?

The things you mentioned only happen to the others.

'Yeah, That's what Jesus would do. Jesus would bomb Afghanistan. Yeah.' - snowlion


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